bernieL0max
27-04-2010, 01:36 PM
Hi guys,
I've been looking forward to getting into IPRA to go racing for years... encouraged to make the plunge recently as a way of making some positive change in my life I started looking for a good value car car to get in...
I found an RX7 on eBay, previously raced by the daughter of Allan Kendall in NSW, the listing looked great, I called the current owner, Mr Rob XXXXX (NO ALLAN) and asked;
* has he raced he car much since he has had it; the seller responded that it had not been raced at all since he has owned it
* has the car had any work done to it; the seller responded that no work had been done to it
* was it ready to go racing; the seller responded that it was, his words were almost presicely "yeh mate, good to go"
the original listing can be viewed here;
http://www.profix.com.au/rx7/listing.pdf
I bid and won the car for $5000
Within hours of the auction finishing I paid the seller $1000, contacted him to make him aware that I needed to pull the remaining funds from a term deposit. I am self-employed, over the next couple of days I received payment for invoices so I made 3 more payments of $1000 each to keep the seller super-happy.
When the last of my funds came through I contact the seller, and in passing asked if he had found the logbook... it is at this point that things turned;
the seller tried to extort another $1000 from me for the logbook, a document owned by CAMS which belongs with the vehicle.
The seller then demanded I make final payment or he would keep my deposit & relist the car!
See our entire SMS history for a word-for-word account;
http://www.profixXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX.pdf
Note: the first enquiries regarding a logbook were prior to the auction ending.
So I borrowed a utility, hired a trailer, and set off on a 980km drive to pickup my car in person. In all I travelled 2020km and incurred 2-days trailer rental and the cost of one nights accomodation as a direct result.
I was receiving dodgey eBay messaged and SMSs from the seller on my way up to NSW... i was getting very nervous; he stated on a number of occasions that he would not be available, that he would push the car out onto the street so I could pick it up. The address he gave was XXXX Hassell Street,XXXXXX NSW - his last claim said he was pushing it out regardless of receiving the final payment!!! alarm bells were going off and my GPS said I was many hours away and would not arrive until something like 10pm.
an eBay case was opened, the transcript can be read here;
http://www.profix.com.au/rx7/eBayCase.pdf
Note that I closed this case to transfer it to the eBay Trust Center... I have not heard from them yet
While still travelling to NSW I made calls to Police (no help), Private Investigators (none available), Security companies... found one that would send a guard to watch the premises until 10pm for several hundred dollars... broke, and feeling like I was already in the middle of a planned fraud setup I did not want to throw more money away.
I googled the address he had provided and found a listing for a motorsport company at an adjascent address, I contact this number. The person I spoke with apologies that they had in-fact moved from Hassall Street, but wanted to know more, and offered their sympathy & much to my surprise and appreciation offered to look into the situation for me. Props to XZXXX from Incar Motor Sport... though they are not actually a motorsport company as such they were terrific.
XZXXX called me back to let me know he had discovered them dismantling my car! the engine and box were out... he said he had words with them. He called a little while later to tell me that is was worse than he's first seen, that much of the car had already been stripped; but that he had encouraged them to put it back together. I thanked Mario for his help but he understood when I said that as this point I would be seeking my money back.
When I arrived in NSW I spoke briefly with XZXXX to thank him, then went straight to the Fairfield Police Station... I spent some time with a constable who took sympathy in my situation, he called the seller and advised him that he would need to repay my money, then put me on the phone. The seller was rude, abrupt and irrational, he refused to accept that he would need to refund my money and told me that the car would be ready to go at 9am the next day.
The next day I arranged to meet police at the address that the seller had supplied. I arrived before the police so i parked the car close by, purchased a drink from a corner shop next-door and sat under a tree watching the premises for any sign of my car. After several hours (no police), a person came out and spoke to me from No. 7 - he was adament that his business know nothing about, and had nothing to do with my vehicle. He knew the car I was describing and suggested that it was in-fact 2-sheds up in No. 5 ! I video taped this conversation with my iPhone
My phone was getting flat as I had been using it to post on facebook & ausrotary.com, so I sat back in my car to put the phone on the charger. A short time later the police knocked on my car window.
The police were not there for me, they were there to quiz me on threats that the seller alleged he had received!!!!
After convincing them that I was not involved in any threats the constables came with me to speak with the seller. Police Constables Robinson and Raft from Fairfield Police Station were present and witnessed the sellers admissions that; the photographs used to advertise the vehicle were very old, not a current representation of the vehicle; and that the engine and gearbox were removed from the vehicle.
Some discussion took place before the seller insisted that I could take the vehicle for the $4000 already paid and no more money needed to change hands; I indicated that I would consider this offer, at which point I asked for a closer visual inspection. On entering the workshop I asked that the car be lifted on a hoist, I was told it could not because it was too rusty! A quick look over the exterior of the vehicle revealed considerable rust that was not evident in the images used to represent the vehicle on eBay.
I once again made it very clear that the contract of the sale had been breached and that I was seeking a full refund of the $4000 already paid in good faith; the seller refused a number of times. I made the seller aware that if I was forced to take civil action I would also be seeking for him to reimburse my expenses including fuel, trailer rental, accommodation and legal costs, and that it would likely cost him significantly more, Mr XXXXXXX then told me to “f&*^$% off”. At this the police suggested there was no more to come from any discussion and we left.
There is strong evidence of premeditated criminal fraud associated with this case;
• The seller twice indicated in writing that the car was located at XXXXX St; that he would not be able to meet me; and that the car would be pushed out into the street and left unattended so that I could pick it up.
o The vehicle was actually located at XYZ Street, which is occupied a completely different business with [according to the business owner], no relation to the business at No. 7
• The seller unsuccessfully attempted to extort an additional $1000 from me to supply a logbook; i.e. a document owned by the Confederation of Australian Motor Sport (CAMS);
o the seller has admitted that he was never in possession of this document
o this document cannot be brought/sold independent of the vehicle
I am posting this for several reasons;
* In case *anyone* on this forum can help me
* To warn the community about this seller;
DETAILS REMOVED
* and as a cautionary tale...
* USE PAYPAL! I did not... my funds are now tied up in an exhaustive civil legal battle.
* VIEW A VEHICLE BEFORE BIDDING!... do not trust anything any seller tells you, regardless of how good their eBay score looks!
I can be contacted on 0413 66 33 19 or matts.tc@profix.com.au if anyone is able to offer assistance or advice.
Thanks
Matt Harding
I've been looking forward to getting into IPRA to go racing for years... encouraged to make the plunge recently as a way of making some positive change in my life I started looking for a good value car car to get in...
I found an RX7 on eBay, previously raced by the daughter of Allan Kendall in NSW, the listing looked great, I called the current owner, Mr Rob XXXXX (NO ALLAN) and asked;
* has he raced he car much since he has had it; the seller responded that it had not been raced at all since he has owned it
* has the car had any work done to it; the seller responded that no work had been done to it
* was it ready to go racing; the seller responded that it was, his words were almost presicely "yeh mate, good to go"
the original listing can be viewed here;
http://www.profix.com.au/rx7/listing.pdf
I bid and won the car for $5000
Within hours of the auction finishing I paid the seller $1000, contacted him to make him aware that I needed to pull the remaining funds from a term deposit. I am self-employed, over the next couple of days I received payment for invoices so I made 3 more payments of $1000 each to keep the seller super-happy.
When the last of my funds came through I contact the seller, and in passing asked if he had found the logbook... it is at this point that things turned;
the seller tried to extort another $1000 from me for the logbook, a document owned by CAMS which belongs with the vehicle.
The seller then demanded I make final payment or he would keep my deposit & relist the car!
See our entire SMS history for a word-for-word account;
http://www.profixXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX.pdf
Note: the first enquiries regarding a logbook were prior to the auction ending.
So I borrowed a utility, hired a trailer, and set off on a 980km drive to pickup my car in person. In all I travelled 2020km and incurred 2-days trailer rental and the cost of one nights accomodation as a direct result.
I was receiving dodgey eBay messaged and SMSs from the seller on my way up to NSW... i was getting very nervous; he stated on a number of occasions that he would not be available, that he would push the car out onto the street so I could pick it up. The address he gave was XXXX Hassell Street,XXXXXX NSW - his last claim said he was pushing it out regardless of receiving the final payment!!! alarm bells were going off and my GPS said I was many hours away and would not arrive until something like 10pm.
an eBay case was opened, the transcript can be read here;
http://www.profix.com.au/rx7/eBayCase.pdf
Note that I closed this case to transfer it to the eBay Trust Center... I have not heard from them yet
While still travelling to NSW I made calls to Police (no help), Private Investigators (none available), Security companies... found one that would send a guard to watch the premises until 10pm for several hundred dollars... broke, and feeling like I was already in the middle of a planned fraud setup I did not want to throw more money away.
I googled the address he had provided and found a listing for a motorsport company at an adjascent address, I contact this number. The person I spoke with apologies that they had in-fact moved from Hassall Street, but wanted to know more, and offered their sympathy & much to my surprise and appreciation offered to look into the situation for me. Props to XZXXX from Incar Motor Sport... though they are not actually a motorsport company as such they were terrific.
XZXXX called me back to let me know he had discovered them dismantling my car! the engine and box were out... he said he had words with them. He called a little while later to tell me that is was worse than he's first seen, that much of the car had already been stripped; but that he had encouraged them to put it back together. I thanked Mario for his help but he understood when I said that as this point I would be seeking my money back.
When I arrived in NSW I spoke briefly with XZXXX to thank him, then went straight to the Fairfield Police Station... I spent some time with a constable who took sympathy in my situation, he called the seller and advised him that he would need to repay my money, then put me on the phone. The seller was rude, abrupt and irrational, he refused to accept that he would need to refund my money and told me that the car would be ready to go at 9am the next day.
The next day I arranged to meet police at the address that the seller had supplied. I arrived before the police so i parked the car close by, purchased a drink from a corner shop next-door and sat under a tree watching the premises for any sign of my car. After several hours (no police), a person came out and spoke to me from No. 7 - he was adament that his business know nothing about, and had nothing to do with my vehicle. He knew the car I was describing and suggested that it was in-fact 2-sheds up in No. 5 ! I video taped this conversation with my iPhone
My phone was getting flat as I had been using it to post on facebook & ausrotary.com, so I sat back in my car to put the phone on the charger. A short time later the police knocked on my car window.
The police were not there for me, they were there to quiz me on threats that the seller alleged he had received!!!!
After convincing them that I was not involved in any threats the constables came with me to speak with the seller. Police Constables Robinson and Raft from Fairfield Police Station were present and witnessed the sellers admissions that; the photographs used to advertise the vehicle were very old, not a current representation of the vehicle; and that the engine and gearbox were removed from the vehicle.
Some discussion took place before the seller insisted that I could take the vehicle for the $4000 already paid and no more money needed to change hands; I indicated that I would consider this offer, at which point I asked for a closer visual inspection. On entering the workshop I asked that the car be lifted on a hoist, I was told it could not because it was too rusty! A quick look over the exterior of the vehicle revealed considerable rust that was not evident in the images used to represent the vehicle on eBay.
I once again made it very clear that the contract of the sale had been breached and that I was seeking a full refund of the $4000 already paid in good faith; the seller refused a number of times. I made the seller aware that if I was forced to take civil action I would also be seeking for him to reimburse my expenses including fuel, trailer rental, accommodation and legal costs, and that it would likely cost him significantly more, Mr XXXXXXX then told me to “f&*^$% off”. At this the police suggested there was no more to come from any discussion and we left.
There is strong evidence of premeditated criminal fraud associated with this case;
• The seller twice indicated in writing that the car was located at XXXXX St; that he would not be able to meet me; and that the car would be pushed out into the street and left unattended so that I could pick it up.
o The vehicle was actually located at XYZ Street, which is occupied a completely different business with [according to the business owner], no relation to the business at No. 7
• The seller unsuccessfully attempted to extort an additional $1000 from me to supply a logbook; i.e. a document owned by the Confederation of Australian Motor Sport (CAMS);
o the seller has admitted that he was never in possession of this document
o this document cannot be brought/sold independent of the vehicle
I am posting this for several reasons;
* In case *anyone* on this forum can help me
* To warn the community about this seller;
DETAILS REMOVED
* and as a cautionary tale...
* USE PAYPAL! I did not... my funds are now tied up in an exhaustive civil legal battle.
* VIEW A VEHICLE BEFORE BIDDING!... do not trust anything any seller tells you, regardless of how good their eBay score looks!
I can be contacted on 0413 66 33 19 or matts.tc@profix.com.au if anyone is able to offer assistance or advice.
Thanks
Matt Harding