LSX 440 Project

[justin@russo]

We have finally recieved the engine block and a number of other goodies from the USA. We assembled the bottom end to check all the clearencing now its away to the machine shop to notch the block for the 4.100 crank to clear the bottom of the cylinders. The block is a GM ls7 4.125 bore with the crank we are using it raises the ci to 438ci.
I will post photos as we go.


http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02435a.jpg

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02434a.jpg

[NickS]

:bravo: ... I'm excited and it's not even mine !!!

Thanks for the pics Justin, keep 'em coming. You must be getting excited now Dunc.

[35R]

wow, thanks Justin.

first time i have seen the block.

:woohoo: :woot: :dance: :driving: :burnout: :bow: :eyes:

[scat2k3]

I'm looking forward to following this thread. Thanks Justin and Dunc for kicking it off and sharing.

This thing is going to sound awesome :bravo: I can't imaging how much grunt its going to have :shock:

Cheers,

Scott

[seldo]

I guess 438ci should be ....ermmm....adequate...:shock:

[DaveHAT]

I guess 438ci should be ....ermmm....adequate...:shock:

Somewhat ... :yep:

[Scotty]

I guess 438ci should be ....ermmm....adequate...:shock:

not at all... I heard that he is considering a turbo for each cylinder.....

Cant wait to see how it progresses... and even better how she performs around wakefield.....

[35R]

not at all... I heard that he is considering a turbo for each cylinder.....

Cant wait to see how it progresses... and even better how she performs around wakefield.....

not for each cylinder Scotty, that would be just silly.

[lautray]

Wicked :yahoo:.

[seedyrom]

those distances between cylinders are .... ummm ... cosy

nice block

[Febs]

First official "You're a bastard Dunc" post. :waving:

This is going to be a monster. :yep: Nice work. :bravo:

[35R]

Yep big bores alright

Here's another pic from GM

http://us.tnpv.net/2005/GMC200508/GMC2005080260290_PV.jpg

[SSUte01]

Jeez it's still overbore, sure can't squeeze a few more cubes outta of it - I reckon eight litres is a goer (488ci), a nice even litre per cylinder.

In all seriousness, I am excited too, that thing wont be outta place on V8SC starting grid. Mmmm good - just how the general intedned. Dunc, I am so jealous it hurts.

It is simply awesome - can't wait:bravo:

[lautray]

Looking forward to a ride in the passengers seat down at Heathcote, hint-hint :waving: .

[Scotty]

Lking forward to a ride in the passengers seat down at Heathcote, hint-hint :waving: .

Bugger that... Dunc I am looking forward to a drive around Wakey... well maybe in the passenger seat then...

[35R]

I think I might need to hire someone to teach me to drive it actually. It will be fun trying that's for sure.

[FatBoy]

Given that i towelled you at the karting despite my greater girth i reckon i should get first shot at helping you out there Dunc... :waving:

Cheers,
Paul...


P.S - The bloke that beat us only did so because he was 40kgs lighter mate... :lol:

[35R]

Given that i towelled you at the karting despite my greater girth i reckon i should get first shot at helping you out there Dunc... :waving:

Cheers,
Paul...


P.S - The bloke that beat us only did so because he was 40kgs lighter mate... :lol:

i'll take all the tuition i can get Paul, think i will need it more than ever.

As for Mick......... May 31st.....Wakefield

[Kyle]

Light on the throttle outta the corners... easy....easssyyy :D

[BOMI]

B.L.A.T/ Slide / B.L.A.T


Oh and these http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/Big_balls1.jpg


Troy :)

[drewbytes]

Awesome! 438 cubes will be lots of fun :)

[RedVYIISS]

Dunc, you'll need to change your user name (again!)... it's only a piddly 438 you know!!!

[FatBoy]

i'll take all the tuition i can get Paul, think i will need it more than ever.

Was only stirring mate, your times indicate you have a pretty good idea of what you are doing... :yep:

There's a couple of places down at Wakefield where you can really make up a decent chunk of time though - we can have a chat next time there's a track day or get together and i'll run you through the same advice i got - which helped me pick up over a second a lap without changing anything... :)

Sounds like the new engine will be a real animal, can't wait to see it in action !!

Cheers,
Paul...

[35R]

Dunc, you'll need to change your user name (again!)... it's only a piddly 438 you know!!!

Dayum! 440 sounds better but

[bok1]

well well well 438 going into the monaro i presume??
i will have start to mod the hell outa the ssv now.here we go again look's like i will be giving russo a call.good on you duncan i hope it all work's out well for you.


phil

[Febs]

well well well 438 going into the monaro i presume??

Either that or Dunc's holding out on us, and the "container" the LS7 shipped in was actually a "Corvette Z06". :lol: :lol:

[justin@russo]

here is some more pics of the engine build.

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02439bb.jpg

the block had to go to the machine shop for some modifications to accomidate the bigger stroke , and to be honed as the piston to bore clearance was to tight

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02442bb.jpg

the crank we have used is an eagle forged 4.100 stroke and the whole rotating assembly has been balanced with a flywheel and balancer attached

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02444bb.jpg

the main bearing caps and bolts are standard ls7 being 6 bolt mains there is know need to upgrade this section of the engine for what are doing with it

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02459bb.jpg

the pistons we have used are arias customs with a small dish cause this has to run on pulp

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02464bb.jpg

here you can see were the block has been notched to clear the conrod

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02467bb.jpg

we choose to use a longer eagle conrod (6.200 instead of 6.125) they come standard with arp 8740 rod bolts ( rated around 700hp) we upgraded them with arp 2000 bolts as they rated 1200 hp a little insurance as ussually when an engine lets go it seems to be around the rod bolt area.

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02469bb.jpg

thats as far as we got today hopfully tomorrow i will get the cam so we can dial it in and seal up the bottom end and move on to the heads

[35R]

wow, great stuff Justin, thanks for posting the pics mate.

[Kyle]

WOW!! 10char

[RedVYIISS]

Out of interest, I know the LS7 rod piston assembly is VERY light to allow sustained operation at 7000 rpm (basically Le Mans 24 hr). How heavy is the Arias/Eagle assembly compared to the LS7, and what sort of 'red line' revs are proposed for this one?

BTW, looks fantastic so far, I'll bet Dunc's feeling like there's another baby on the way!

Double BTW, I love tech stuff like this, great thread!

[35R]

I dont know about the weight difference with titanium rods. There are some discussions on ls1tech about the merits of titanium in the LS7 street car motor. Some interesting conclusions too. For the way the Z06 is set up, titanium is overkill. At $US300~$US500 per rod, and taking months to make, i couldnt afford it anyway, and wouldnt wait. But if I had the money (and time) there would be many other uprated components i would have to get to match; it would double the cost of the motor (at least). I have my eye on some lunati stuff though... maybe next time!

[BOMI]

Looks freaken awesome.

Allan I agree with you, this sort of tech info. As a driver I know all I need to about tunning but still know next to SFA about engine build specs. Yeah I know about pistons, conrods, cranks etc but threads like these are good for learning about internals.

Keep up the good work Russo fellas :thumbs:


Troy :cheers:

[drewbytes]

Can I ask why you're building an engine rather than just buying an LS7 complete? Is it just so you can build it cheaper?

[35R]

It would probably cost more to import and modify an LS7 crate motor to suit.

However Russo are super keen to flesh out & develop potential with some of the latest GM parts (intake and head stuff is interesting) and I can't wait to see the result.

It's a bit of a journey (as I am sure you are aware Drew) with some fun and anticipation along the way. We started off with plans for a 402.. and it kind of snowballed, as these things do! Some interesting work happening with the heads right now. And I believe they have picked up a special cam today.

[drewbytes]

Thought that would be it. When I win lotto a 500 ci monster stroker would be great :)

[Scotty]

the crank we have used is an eagle forged 4.100 stroke and the whole rotating assembly has been balanced with a flywheel and balancer attached


What is the benefit of doing this?

[PSI38L]

Should be an absolute grunter, do you have a power/torque figure your aiming for?

[justin@russo]

Out of interest, I know the LS7 rod piston assembly is VERY light to allow sustained operation at 7000 rpm (basically Le Mans 24 hr). How heavy is the Arias/Eagle assembly compared to the LS7, and what sort of 'red line' revs are proposed for this one?

BTW, looks fantastic so far, I'll bet Dunc's feeling like there's another baby on the way!

Double BTW, I love tech stuff like this, great thread!

Allan the piston and rod combo we are using are around 120g heavier but we are not building the engine to run 7000rpm for hours on end. there are a few things on the ls7 engine that are definentley overkill for a road car ( titanium rods, dry sump etc) in saying that this is a good question and we did consider rod weights especially after increasing the stroke even more this is why we decided to use a longer rod. The rpm limit will be around 6700

[lautray]

The rpm limit will be around 6700
No more 7000rpm launches :eek: .

[justin@russo]

What is the benefit of doing this?

i actually watched this engine go through the balancing process, the crank had the piston and rod weights attatched the the big end journels and when it was spun up it shuddered violently we attatched the flywheel and the balancer and respun it was much smoother but still needed 80g taken of the rear of the crank. if the engine was left out of balance it would defientley effect bearing life engine rpm etc.

[Febs]

Very interesting, good work guys. Keep up the info/pics. :)

Never knew what "notching" meant. Now I do. :)

Cheers,
- Febs.

[RedVYIISS]

i actually watched this engine go through the balancing process, the crank had the piston and rod weights attatched the the big end journels and when it was spun up it shuddered violently we attatched the flywheel and the balancer and respun it was much smoother but still needed 80g taken of the rear of the crank. if the engine was left out of balance it would defientley effect bearing life engine rpm etc.

Again, interesting stuff Justin.

I was only recently made aware of revs v's rotating mass v's piston speed etc by a mate building up a 'destroked' turbo Lexus V8. It's a boat racing motor, destroked to 3.6 L, 10,000 rpm redline, made 1,400 Hp on the engine dyno recently. I believe thay had to get a custom made crank made (probably rods too) as it's never been done before. (it's been destroked to 3.6 L as it's allowed that capacity with F/I to run in a 6 litre class)

[seldo]

An excellent thread Justin. For those who haven't seen what goes into building a good engine it's very informative. Keep it up - esp the photos. Another generally unknown/unappreciated area is ring-gaps and piston/bore clearances, and valve/piston clearances too. It starts to help the uninitiated understand why it costs plenty to build one of things - There's a lot more to it than just buying all the bits and chucking them together.:bravo:

[DaveHAT]

Thanks Juzzy, :bravo: great info and reading for someone with NFI when it comes to engine building. Perhaps NFI in general :lol:

Anywho ... pls keep it coming am following this with interest.

On a side note, will Christian or yourself be counselling fallout boy Lautray to get him used to the idea of no more 7000rpm launches? :waving:

[choppo]

Justin, just another note of support to keep the info coming - very interesting indeed!

[35R]

A few more pics of some goodies (click pic for larger version)

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/thumbs/P3232009.jpg (http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/medium/P3232009.jpg) Piston

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/thumbs/P3132003.jpg (http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/medium/P3132003.jpg) Intake and heads

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/thumbs/P3132002.jpg (http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/medium/P3132002.jpg) Intake and TB

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/thumbs/P3131997.JPG (http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/medium/P3131997.JPG) LS7 Block

[Scotty]

Thanks Justin!

[justin@russo]

we finally recieved the camshaft for duncans car it is a custom grind so it has taken some time to get it i took some pics today as we installed it



http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02480a.jpg

the chain and gear set it a single row heavy duty, we were limited here as the cam angle sensor is in the front cover and is triggered of the cam gear
http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02495a.jpg

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02497a.jpg

[35R]

thanks for the pics Justin, looking great!

[scat2k3]

Looking good guys. I love these "build up" threads.

Thanks for taking the time and effort to keep us up to date on this.

Bet you can't wait for this thing to be dropped in the Munro, hey Dunc?

Cheers,

Scott

[Pulse Red]

Personally I think this thing is going to be a bit soft.

NOT! Sounds like an awesome engine and I do enjoy reading all the info being made available.

Considering the grunt of your H/C combo, your Monaro will be a bit of an eye opener when this thing is slotted in Duncan! :shock:

Bags shotgun for a trip around the block when its done :bravo:

[justin@russo]

Dunc i thought you might like to see some pics of the old motor before it came out


http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02498a.jpg



http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02499a.jpg




we had a sump built for your new motor it easly holds 11 litres





http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02508a.jpg




here is a pic of the inlet runners they are very different to the ls1 ls6 heads, untouched they flow around 320cfm.

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02503a.jpg


tommorow i should have the 440 in the car,so we will be ready to fire it up midweek
i will post more pics tommorow.

[35R]

wow sump looks great Justin.

So those heads flow 320cfm untouched, but did you touch em up?!

[35R]

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02497a.jpg[/QUOTE]

Justin what does this thing do/measure/check?

[Kyle]

Thats arunout gauge I believe.

But what it's checking, i cannot see.

Actually, it's tip is sitting on a pushrod i think?

[veewhytu]

Great writeup guys, keep the piccies coming.

Thats some nice fabrication work on the sump...11 litres :shock: cant see lack of oil being a problem!

Whats that blue beast in the background Justin..not another bloody camaro is it? :stick:

[DaveHAT]

http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/DSC02480a.jpg


OMG :shock: how big are those pistons? Holy snappin ducks flop.

Cmon Justin ... more .. we want more already :bravo:

Can I place one order for a sound grab of when it's first turned over? :yep:

[Justice]

I have a double row chain using the sensor in the cover and trigger off the gear as per the pic below. Give me a buzz if you need one Dunc as I have a spare.


http://www.trackchat.com.au/media/data/500/car_058.jpg

[35R]

thanks Darren!

Welcome to the forum btw, glad you made it.

btw did you modify the (front) LS2 covers yourself or did you buy them this way? We had a very nice billet LS2 item for the moment.

[Justice]

thanks Darren!

Welcome to the forum btw, glad you made it.

btw did you modify the (front) LS2 covers yourself or did you buy them this way? We had a very nice billet LS2 item for the moment.


Sam did it for me

[35R]

Hi guys

We had the car dyno'd today at Castle Hill Exhuast, big thanks to Dale and CHE for their time today.

The motor pulled 505rwhp (377rwkw) - the goal (as many of you know) was a lazy 500rwhp, so we are there!!

But we can't help thinking there is potential left on the table. Russo essentially went very conservative with the cam (given my CBD driving habits) and the intake is definitely not optimal for the cubes. So there are some options (in the medium term future) to materialise the potential. Not that it ultimately needs it, i probably can't drive to the potential anyway.. fun trying nonetheless.

Obviously a massive thanks to Russo for building an awesome motor, I can't wait to see how it goes at WSID.

And thanks Dale for your time today.

[SSUte01]

What an awesome result, always been an NA fan and that it why. FI, pfft. (only joking I love FI too)

You must be stoked - Do the 1st three gears have traction at all if you feed into it

Massive fat torque 'shelf' too, I say shelf cos I bet it doesn't curve too much
:bravo:

[35R]

What an awesome result, always been an NA fan and that it why. FI, pfft. (only joking I love FI too)

You must be stoked - Do the 1st three gears have traction at all if you feed into it

Massive fat torque 'shelf' too, I say shelf cos I bet it doesn't curve too much
:bravo:

Luke, not a problem driving if you drive sedately (below 30% tps)

Stab the throttle and it is instant wheelspin however

[NickS]

Hi guys

We had the car dyno'd today at Castle Hill Exhuast, big thanks to Dale and CHE for their time today.

The motor pulled 505rwhp (377rwkw) - the goal (as many of you know) was a lazy 500rwhp, so we are there!!

Love your work Dunc ... you may not remember, but the Coupe 4 pulled 505awhp.

:thumbs:

Congrats. Dunc, Chris & Justin (in no particular order) ... that's an awesome result.

[DaveHAT]

Goddam ... :shock:

Get this thing breathing better and lordy knows what the final digit would be.

kudos to the Russo duo and Elpresidente for the desire to pursue it :bravo: ... a true "journey man" :D :waving:

Cheers,

Mr destination.

[cosmo vyss]

Outstanding result Duncan. Well done to the Russo Team for screwing it all together and for the updates.
I can't wait to hear this thing run around wakey tommorow.

Congrats again Duncan, i am sure you are over the moon. :bravo:

JB
Jealous

[veewhytu]

Thats some big hp Dunc....last time i saw it i said to Justin, those tailpipes look like they came off a stocker!

Its certainly a wolf in sheeps clothing.:woot:

[RedVYIISS]

Damn.... another car pushes me down the ladder at CHE! (mine made 502.5 Hp).

Well done fella's... that's one tough n/a engine!

[BOMI]

:eek::eek::eek::eek:

Im so going for a lap with you tomorrow mate.

Well done to the Russo team :yep:

Troy :D

[Febs]

New it had some herbs! :D

Great figure Dunc. Can't complain about a ~500kw engine! Be a while before they're bringing them out from the factory like that (a select few excluded).

Cheers,
- Febs.

[stav]

Wha.... ah...um....holl.............

F@#$ me.... That is awesome Dunc. Can't wait to go for a ride in it.

What a shame your quarter mile time is going to go up though... after all, you will be spinning in first, second, third, fourth.... :whip:

Team Russo... Well done!

[35R]

Love your work Dunc ... you may not remember, but the Coupe 4 pulled 505awhp.

:thumbs:

Congrats. Dunc, Chris & Justin (in no particular order) ... that's an awesome result.

really?

lol. 505 must be the magical number

[Kyle]

Freaking awesome! :D

So are you going to leave it here now, no more development dunc? :)

[10sec_rx7]

it was a pleasure today dunc,

gives us somthing to shoot with for daves new engine,

anyone who thinks a 500rwhp stoker is a pig to drive needs to drive this car, soo much fun!! :)

[Quadcams]

Goddam Duncan, thats one tuff n/a motor well done mate definately must be fun to drive street or strip.:bravo: